Design x Fonz Morris
Lead Product Designer for Global Conversion at Netflix
Illustration by Bonnie Kate Wolf
Interview conducted by Michelle Berois on July 24, 2020
Tell us a little about yourself. Where are you from originally?
I’m a proud New Yorker. I grew up in Brooklyn, specifically in Bedford–Stuyvesant. Growing up in New York was so influential to my becoming a designer. I was exposed to some of the most amazing architecture in the world every day. Whether it’s the World Trade Center, the Empire State Building, the transit system, or brownstones at Bed-Stuy, the architecture is amazing. I think about the field trips I went on to see the MoMA or the Brooklyn Natural History Museum. New York is such a cultural city that I didn’t even realize I was building my design foundations.
I ended up going to an arts high school and decided I wanted to become an architect, but my friend’s father told me, “Hey, you don’t really make a lot of money in architecture. It’s gonna take you a long time.” I didn’t want to hear that at sixteen, so there went my architecture dreams. I ended up going to college for computer science because that’s where I saw the industry was going. I wanted to become a computer engineer and focus on hardware.
I ended up leaving New York to change my environment and get that college experience that everyone always talked about. I went to Morehouse in Atlanta because I wanted to go to an HBCU. I ended up leaving Morehouse for Georgia State because I became a Georgia resident and that lowered my tuition.
I was paying for this on my own, so I tried to get an education however I could. In my senior year, the college received a grant from the state of Georgia to open up a multimedia lab called The Digital Aquarium. This was a state-of-the-art lab completely furnished with all the new Mac and PC multimedia equipment and tools. I spent all my time trying to learn these new tools and skills, so I practically moved into the lab. My goal was to teach myself all the skills I needed to build a digital design agency. I then built my first website for a furniture company. When it was time to get paid, I could not believe what they paid us. It completely floored me.
There was no turning back. I got my hands on whatever kind of digital design work I could do. At the time, I wanted to do music videos but felt the music video space was too saturated, so I focused on doing web and graphic design. Once I got deeper into web design, I realized that I needed to learn web development and also create my own designs so I could be this hybrid double threat.
It ended up being super beneficial because tech is so design- and engineering-dominant. You’re either a designer who needs to talk to an engineer, or an engineer who needs to talk to a designer. By being able to walk that thin rope, I was always in demand. I’ve always been able to get a job since The Digital Aquarium.
My skills got sharper as the industry continued to grow. I was working an art direction job while I was building and growing the design agency. We ended up getting acquired by one of our clients who needed our skills. They eventually put up my first angel fund for me to build my first product, MyArtistDNA. I feel like that’s where I made the transition from graphic and web design to product design.
As the industry grew, I kept getting better product design positions with more responsibility. I did a second startup with the same guys that I did my first startup with, but that didn’t work out. Soon after that, I went back to corporate America and got the job at Coursera. I was there for a little over a year, and then I started at Netflix a couple of months ago.
Was there a specific moment when you knew that product design was the path you wanted to follow?
As I started to grow and build bigger projects for people, I learned what the word “scalable” meant. We were doing a lot of custom websites, but they were taking too long to do. We needed to build something that was more of a template or framework that we could give the client so they could do whatever they needed to. We needed to think more about design systems, and that was exciting to me.
You were recently featured in an AfroTech article where you talked about your entrepreneurial ventures. How have those business ventures shaped you as a product designer?
I got to really see what business was all about, that experience that you need, that shot that a lot of people don’t get. That’s why, in my success now, I want to offer that shot to people the way my investors offered that shot to me. I was able to learn so much and grow from those experiences, and now I’m doing amazing things. If I hadn’t taken those leaps into those two businesses, I wouldn’t have learned as much. I met so many people and got to do so many cool things. The experience was priceless and so rewarding. Just because something isn’t successful, that doesn’t mean it can’t be rewarding.
“Just because something isn’t successful, that doesn’t mean it can’t be rewarding.”
Even though those two companies weren’t successful, I was able to prove to myself and to everybody that I’m as good as I always said I was. It’s important in making sure you don’t develop imposter syndrome.
What’s the biggest learning that you took away from that experience?
You should think twice about starting a business with friends because, if the business doesn’t work out, you could end up losing a friendship like I did. Just because you’re cousins, sisters, or brothers, that doesn’t mean it’s a guaranteed recipe for success. Align yourself with people who have the same goal and vision and can do what they need to. Being friends has nothing to do with that.
What attracted you to EdTech and how did you make your way over to Coursera?
Learning is something I’ve always been passionate about. I’ve always taken online courses and consider myself a self-taught designer. When General Assembly first started, I was fortunate enough to meet one of the co-founders and was one of the first people to enroll in their courses. I understood that online education was the future, so it felt obvious for me to work at Coursera. It also gave me the opportunity to move from Philadelphia to California to become part of the design and tech Silicon Valley space.
What were some of your most favorite projects that you worked on at Coursera?
Coursera was really rewarding. I did a lot of things, personally and professionally, that I love to think back on. I was able to champion two different internal programs that aren’t even really related to design.
The first was a “Friends and Family” idea where all Coursera employees get to bring three people onto the platform for free for a year. My thinking behind that was because if the company I work for was telling me they care about my wellbeing, the wellbeing of my family is intrinsic to that, so why would you only offer me these courses, and not my family? When I suggested that, the CEO stood up and asked if there were any objections. There were none, so he said, “Go. Run with it.” We got such great feedback from people all over the world. I feel like that impact will reverberate forever.
The second program was for people who were previously incarcerated and are reentering society. Coursera was already working on social impact programs for veterans, low-income high schools, and refugees, but I realized they didn’t have programs for people of my community who had been impacted by mass incarceration. A big issue for this vulnerable population is lack of education. Offering Coursera’s platform to people as they reenter society is crucial and so necessary. Coursera asked me if I wanted to lead it, so I ran with that too. I’m happy to say that the program has partnered with amazing organizations like Cut50 and Columbia University. It was so rewarding to build those programs, have thousands of people sign up and know that these programs will be a part of Coursera forever.
My career has been rewarding in so many different ways as opposed to just wondering what’s the best design I’ve done. Because I did do some fire designs at Coursera. I redesigned the homepage and gave them a whole new look. I redid an internal advertising system that resulted in millions in revenue. While I was on the growth team, our signups were at the highest in the history of the company.
I did a lot of things there, professionally and personally, but the personal stuff is what really mattered to me and will end up being more important than the design work. Even just being a great ally for all of my co-workers who didn’t really have somebody like me there. A Black man from Brooklyn who’s vocal but intelligent, who’s funny but cool, understanding, empathetic, and open-minded. All those different things—they’re kind of hard to find in tech.
So when people see that, they gravitate towards you. That energy was what Coursera needed at that moment. I was able to implement a lot of changes and I had a great time there. I’m really glad that Coursera gave me an opportunity.
As a designer and a person of color, what do you feel is a designer’s role in light of events happening now like the Black Lives Matter movement? What are ways we as a society can help propel that movement forward?
Be a voice for your community. I always try to be, whether I’m standing up saying, “You don’t hire enough people from my community,” supporting other people from my community, or keeping my community in mind in my designs.
In some circles, there usually is no one being that voice. I’ve been fortunate enough to be that voice at some of the biggest companies for some amazing projects. It’s not even just because of the recent tragedies that have happened. I’m proud to be from my community, so I represent it and stand up for it all the time. It could be in a meeting or when somebody says something that’s not appropriate. It could be educating somebody on something that they didn’t know, or being educated myself so I can take that information back to my community.
It’s about being that voice, and trying to find ways to represent that voice in whatever your medium is. Design is huge, so there are so many ways to do it. I always like to say (and I’m gonna coin this phrase), it’s “standing up however you can.” Some people make murals, but that’s not my thing, so I make sure that people of color are represented in the designs I’m making for this million-dollar company. Some people feel comfortable protesting. Some may donate. I don’t want somebody who doesn’t go to a protest to feel like they’re not doing something right. Do whatever you feel comfortable with. It’s such a huge world, and design is so vast and inclusive. I just want people to stand up and do the right thing to whatever their abilities are.
“I just want people to stand up and do the right thing to whatever their abilities are.”
What are some good resources for people who want to start learning more about Black history and the movement itself?
I love that question. That’s a good question, and I don’t say that a lot because I feel like that’s cliche.
I think it’s about going to the root and trying to figure out what you’re trying to learn. What’s important to you in this? Why are you trying to learn this? If I just send you to one generic spot it might not be the best spot for you. You might not be trying to be introduced from that perspective, like if I say “go learn about slavery” or “go learn about civil rights.”
Instead, I think it varies depending on what knowledge that person is looking for and what mediums are comfortable and enjoyable for them. You want to watch some movies? I got a great movie I can tell you to watch about James Baldwin. You want to read books? I can tell you some fiction and some nonfiction books to read. You want to go to some museums? I’ll tell you some museums to go to. You want to go to some Black neighborhoods? I can point you to some. But before I tell you to go to those Black neighborhoods, I need to tell you why those specific neighborhoods are important and what value you should probably be trying to get from visiting those communities.
It’s about you really deciding what you want out of this and by answering a simple question like that. It gives you the first step to knowing that maybe you want to watch a movie because there’s a movie that addresses this exactly. Maybe going to a speaking event is more valuable for you because you gravitate to their stories and can learn more about that person and relate to what they’re doing.
Find something that you personally and passionately connect with. Start there, instead of the same exact resources everybody recommends.
That’s a great answer. If people want to learn about specific resources, can they reach out and connect with you personally?
Always! I’m all for people reaching out and contacting me, because I feel like I grow from every one-on-one conversation. I’m always open, so please feel free to tell everybody to holler.
As someone who’s been in a hiring position before, what do you think are some of the key qualities, traits or skills that are important for a product designer to be successful?
Knowing how to tell a story and understanding the value of communication. As a designer, you’re always trying to communicate something to somebody. I also look for people who know how to solve problems in really interesting, efficient, and scalable ways.
To me, designers are problem-solvers. That’s what I do every day. What problem am I trying to solve? Depends on the company. Depends on the team. Are you trying to get more people to sign up? Are you trying to get more people to watch these videos? Is the problem that the numbers are low? Or is the problem that people aren’t watching long enough?
As a designer, I feel like I’m always solving some kind of problem. I’m not necessarily always looking for how good you are at a tool or software because you can get better in that. What I’m trying to see is how you think. Would I like to work with you? Are you a nice person? Are you somebody that I can learn from?
All of those things as opposed to who is the best designer. Because what if you don’t have a nice personality? So you want somebody that has more than just a craft. That’s what I’m looking for. Having a personality and empathy, that’s the most important. Empathy for the user to ensure that whatever they’re making is designed for the user, not themselves.
Nobody’s perfect, so I’m never looking for a perfect person. I’m not looking for a unicorn. All of that is propaganda. I treat each person with respect and individuality, because that’s what they’re bringing to the table.
“I treat each person with respect and individuality, because that’s what they’re bringing to the table.”
I remember briefly meeting you at a design mentor event for Cascade SF. What motivated you to want to become a mentor for them?
I’m all about giving back to my community. That was a big part of me wanting to move out here. Being part of the design community is important to me, so I joined all these different groups. When I saw the opportunity at Cascade SF, I jumped on it.
I love mentoring and supporting up-and-coming designers. I didn’t really have a lot of portfolio reviews growing up, but I now know the value of them. I like to offer portfolio reviews because it’s probably some of the best feedback you can give a designer.
As a mentor, what do you feel is the best advice you can give junior designers who are just starting out?
When designers ask me what I think about their portfolios, I ask them, “Are you telling a story? This portfolio is your introduction to me. You should craft it however you want to be represented.” I don’t think there’s a one-size-fits-all for portfolios.
When someone lands on your page, have a short little blurb about who you are so that the reader can have an understanding of what they’re getting into. Then showcase your strongest projects. I don’t need six to eight projects to see how good you are. Find your best work and spend your time crafting those projects to be the best that they can be for the portfolio. Let the reader know immediately what problem you were solving, what the solution was, and what your role was in it, especially if you were part of a big team so I can know exactly what you did. A lot of people don’t realize that’s what they should be focusing on.
The goal of your portfolio is to stand out. If you’re a visual designer, focus on showcasing the design decisions behind the visual design. If you’re a content writer, show how you craft your copy. Depending on what you’re doing, you should be trying to tweak your portfolio to highlight the strong points you know you have.
Another thing I would tell a junior designer is, you are what you are when you say you are. Nobody’s gonna ride in with a magic wand and say, “Ping! Now you’re a designer!” It’s about building the confidence to get started, and then getting better over time. If you’ve done your first project and you want to call yourself a junior product designer, why not? You are. Now work on that and continue to improve. If this is what you want to be and this is what you’ve been putting time into, then that’s what you are. You’re just at the beginning stages.
Being able to claim that kind of title means a lot. I think a lot of people are nervous about taking that first step and are too hard on themselves. There’s a lot of self-esteem and self-confidence that goes into design. I want all of my up-and-coming people to feel comfortable with calling themselves designers and doing the work to earn that, as opposed to thinking “I can’t do that” or “I can’t be that” or “I’m not there yet.” Who told you that you weren’t?
I think it’s really important for people to hear because those are the types of thoughts that keep you up at night. Don’t be afraid to give yourself some credit, be happy and have fun with it. If you’re not passionate about design, I don’t know if you should be in it. Passion is what gets you through the rough times and it’s what makes the fun times even better.
“Passion is what gets you through the rough times and it’s what makes the fun times even better.”
Do you have any mentors or people that have influenced you along your journey?
My dad, my sister, my godfather, and my grandmother—all the people who always made me feel loved and smart, that I was smart and that I’d be able to do things and be a big success for our family. I heard that early on, so I always had it in the back of my mind. Even during rough times, it always helped me feel like I could get through it.
Those are the foundational things that you really need. If you build a career and you don’t have that true self-confidence or self-love, then what you’re building will waver and all it takes is one wrong move to make it come crashing down around you. If you’re confident growing up and have self-esteem, self-love, and self-respect, people will see it and like you more. They’ll gravitate to you, and you’ll be able to build relationships and turn those relationships into opportunities.
How about people who haven’t had that experience and are lacking that confidence? What kind of advice would you give them?
Take a step back and just think about what you really want to do. What’s your dream job? Is it to work at Facebook, Tesla, or maybe Nike? You have to know where you want to go before you try to get there. The dreaming part should be fun. It’s free and most people don’t even do that anymore. From that dream, take that first step of checking out that company’s career page and see what they’re hiring for. If you see your dream job, now you have a blueprint for some of the skills you need to learn. It helps you form a starting point.
Now you’ve gone from having a dream to trying to figure out how to actually execute on that dream. Who would you love to work with? Take the time to really think about what kind of brands you like and what values are important to you. Then take all that information and find companies that align with that. This should give you a roadmap to guide you and check yourself against. You need some kind of plan.
When you take the time to focus on that, big things start to seem way more feasible and achievable. It’s a way for you to be able to support yourself and your career path by making sure you take the time to reflect and ask yourself, “What does success look like for me?”
You moved on from Coursera to Netflix. How did that transition come about?
I used to take the train from Mountain View to San Francisco two or three times a week to attend events like Cascade. I ended up attending an event for people of color trying to advance in tech. It was an amazing event at Gusto put together by the Chief Product Officer from Looker. At the end of the event, I was making my way across the room to talk to one of the VPs from Facebook. I ended up bumping into this brother and introducing myself. He was an engineering manager at Netflix, so we got to talking about some people we knew mutually who had worked at Coursera and gone on to Netflix. He then asked me if I had ever thought about working at Netflix. I hadn’t because I was still happy at Coursera, but he told me to take his information anyway and just reach out to him. He had some people that he wanted me to talk to. It wasn’t a recruiter—it was actually another sister who’s a designer there. He thought I should talk to her and see if there’s something there because he felt it would be a good fit.
That’s what got the ball rolling, on top of the fact that I have the entertainment background and I love media and films. Once that interaction happened, it all made sense. Prior to that random interaction at that random event that I went to that random night, I honestly hadn’t thought about it too much. That started the communications that led to the interview process, and I ended up getting offered the position at the end of April. That event ended up organically spawning this amazing new opportunity for me.
These are the types of jewels I like to give, not just to junior designers but people in general. Put out that energy. Be a good person, get out there and work hard, work smart and you never know what’s gonna happen. Things may not always end up working out how you think they will, but it does end up working out. Because I went to San Fran to go to this event, I ended up meeting the engineering manager from Netflix. I could’ve gone home to my wife and 5-year-old, but I’m focused. I know what I need to do. I don’t play games when it comes to that. So I end up having success because, once I say I’m gonna do something, I do it. I don’t let being tired or any other excuses stop me because that’s not how it works.
Rapid Fire Questions
(Those are the best! Go for it. Make them good though, so people can really see how awesome I am.)
I know you’re a sneakerhead. What’s your favorite sneaker, or what are you wearing right now?
Don’t you do that! Don’t you open up that can of worms, that is not what I was expecting! But then I said to myself, “She might ask me about sneakers.”
I’m currently wearing “De La Soul” SB Dunks, a partnership Nike did with De La Soul, the hip hop group. I actually just bought a second pair so I can go dog these out and go home to a brand new pair that I might never wear.
What’s your favorite thing to do in your free time?
Hanging out with my daughter. She cracks me up. She’s growing up so fast, and she’s so smart and creative. I love playing all these little games I make up for her that she loves. I feel so fortunate to get to spend that kind of quality time with her. I’m always going to say my favorite thing to do is spending time with my daughter. Spending time with my family, honestly, but to be specific, it’s playing with my daughter, and talking about our future with my wife.
What’s in your headphones these days?
I listen to a lot of lo-fi chill hip hop because I need it in the background while I’m working. Sometimes hip hop is a little too vulgar, and now that my daughter understands the words, she says, “Oh, so many bad words.” So if she’s around, it’s lo-fi.
If she’s not around, I listen to a lot of hip hop. Recently, I’ve been listening to a playlist I made that’s all over the place. It has a lot of unreleased Nas songs, some Jay-Z, a lot of Wiz Khalifa because I’m on the West Coast now, Lil Baby, and some Kanye. I would say it’s a mixture of lo-fi chill and hip hop all across the board from the ’80s up to the 2000s.
If you like lo-fi chill, I highly recommend going to YouTube and typing in “ChilledCow.” The visual is just this cartoon girl who’s writing things in a book only she can see. It’s this whole underground movement. I love it though. It’s great background music.
